Transgenderism Domino Effect

[plhbg1]

But is the fear really justified when we consider what transgenders really are, how they think, and how they behave? In a place where there is only 2 bathrooms, is it really more appropriate for them to go to the bathroom for men just for being born with deeks?

Does it really feel right for a man to be sharing the bathroom with another stranger who seems feminine through and through, but was to compelled to be there by laws, just because they where born with deeks?

ako straight male ako pero ayoko merong transwoman na kasabay sa pag CR kasi alam kong gusto nila yung anu ko haha kahit nga straight babae eh ang awkward nga kasabay

Sports is definitely a different topic with different solution, pero maybe we should start questioning why bathrooms are structured in the way it is structured. Shared according to gender. Do they have to be like that? I guess that is where the inclusivity conversations should be going, not on questioning their personal identity.

meron ako experiences sa CR na uni-se̾x boss, sa bathroom sign naka slash lang male/female, pag pasok mo merong urinal at meron din basin/bowl uni-se̾x talaga yun especially sa mga offices single bathroom lang talaga walang gender malice

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

meron ako experiences sa CR na uni-se̾x boss, sa bathroom sign naka slash lang male/female, pag pasok mo merong urinal at meron din basin/bowl uni-se̾x talaga yun especially sa mga offices single bathroom lang talaga walang gender malice

Lahat naman tayo meron experience sa ganyan. Kasi sa mga bahay natin yan ang normal.

Ung existing structures nga natin na gendered, tapos walang appropriate na lugar mag cr ang mejo iffy ang gender, yan nga ung tinatawag na systemic discrimination sa loob ng culture natin.

Personally nga, i think yung mga fears natin pag magkasama ang different genders sa isang space tulad ng CR, it is a product of segregation. The more may segregation the more na gumagawa tayo ng demand for opportunistic males. I am not saying may idea ako kung paano ireverse yan, pero the more we segregate, the more we create dangerous males (just like hyper-conservative countries)

 

[plhbg1]

Personally nga, i think yung mga fears natin pag magkasama ang different genders sa isang space tulad ng CR, it is a product of segregation. The more may segregation the more na gumagawa tayo ng demand for opportunistic males. I am not saying may idea ako kung paano ireverse yan, pero the more we segregate, the more we create dangerous males (just like hyper-conservative countries)

ako din parang yung fears ko nakuha ko nung christian pa ako at yung schooling ko na din kasi tinuturo mismo sa schools ang segregation during the basic education ko, pero if walang ganyang mga turo sana like sa bahay eh ok lang naman sa iisang CR, ngayon kahit nag stop na ako sa pagiging christian ay dala dala ko pa din yung mga malicious rules ng previous God ko, through nawawala naman agad if gagamitin ko yung logic pero at first glance talaga the awkward feeling is there pa din

 

[jayendecastro]

Invading is a loaded word. It is full of cultural and religious undertones and pressumption.

We even justify the word "invading" using outliers (fake transgenders) as the reasoning.

But is the fear really justified when we consider what transgenders really are, how they think, and how they behave? In a place where there is only 2 bathrooms, is it really more appropriate for them to go to the bathroom for men just for being born with deeks?

Does it really feel right for a man to be sharing the bathroom with another stranger who seems feminine through and through, but was to compelled to be there by laws, just because they where born with deeks?

Sports is definitely a different topic with different solution, pero maybe we should start questioning why bathrooms are structured in the way it is structured. Shared according to gender. Do they have to be like that? I guess that is where the inclusivity conversations should be going, not on questioning their personal identity.

What word do u prefer we use??

Whats happening sa sports sa US??

Lets skip ung mga fake trans… dun tayo sa actual trans…those people who feel and identify as the opposite gender…

Thats a good qustion, what really are transgenders?

This is what im saying na there are things u simply cant do because of who or what u are…. Being trans does not make u a woman..no matter how much u change yourself…no matter how strong u feel about it….nothing wrong with how u feel or how u identify but it does not change what u really are…

If u have a dîck or u used to have one use the bathroom for people with dïcks…

If u have a **** or used to have a one play sports for people with dicks…

ako straight male ako pero ayoko merong transwoman na kasabay sa pag CR kasi alam kong gusto nila yung anu ko haha kahit nga straight babae eh ang awkward nga kasabay

meron ako experiences sa CR na uni-se̾x boss, sa bathroom sign naka slash lang male/female, pag pasok mo merong urinal at meron din basin/bowl uni-se̾x talaga yun especially sa mga offices single bathroom lang talaga walang gender malice

Madame nman ganan na paps.. katagal lang lagi ng pila lalo na sa SB kauma hahaha

Lahat naman tayo meron experience sa ganyan. Kasi sa mga bahay natin yan ang normal.

Ung existing structures nga natin na gendered, tapos walang appropriate na lugar mag cr ang mejo iffy ang gender, yan nga ung tinatawag na systemic discrimination sa loob ng culture natin.

Personally nga, i think yung mga fears natin pag magkasama ang different genders sa isang space tulad ng CR, it is a product of segregation. The more may segregation the more na gumagawa tayo ng demand for opportunistic males. I am not saying may idea ako kung paano ireverse yan, pero the more we segregate, the more we create dangerous males (just like hyper-conservative countries)

Un nga kasi.. may mga bagay na we can do sa bahay na we cant simply do outside sa public

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

This is what im saying na there are things u simply cant do because of who or what u are…. Being trans does not make u a woman..no matter how much u change yourself…no matter how strong u feel about it….nothing wrong with how u feel or how u identify but it does not change what u really are…

So ano tingin mo ang alternative. Not falling between man or women does not disqualify them from being human at least diba. If ikaw si Gretchen what would you do?
How does that differ from telling an aeta, "no matter ano maabot mo, ano pinag-aralan mo dahil pinanganak kang aeta, dapat mamuhay kang aeta."

Tapos sa US there was a time where black people are not allowed to use a CR for whites. The logic goes, dahil meron CR for people of color dapat doon lang sila. And this was justified by fears. They can cite examples of black people behaving like savages to justify the fear. This was a socially and traditionally accepted practice. Heck some people also use religious justifications because mormons had a belief that blackness is a divine punishment for sinners. How is this different from that?

 

[-power_metal-]

Para sakin nasa utak lang ng tao yan. mahihinang nilalang lang yung papa daig ka sa mali..yung tipong alam mong mali di mo nilalabanan ..alam mong sa mata ng Dyos mali ang bakla di mo nilalabanan. Its a decision na napaka hirap katulad ng isang pagkasawi sa pag ibig na napaka hirap tanggapin na hiwalay na pero pinipilit mo sa sarili mo na kayo parin.. Tulad nga ng sabi nila kung ano yung iniisip yun din ang magagawa mo kung ipipilit mo at lage mo iniisip na bakla ka ganun talaga mangyayari yan ang resulta ng pag iisip mo..dati nung bata pa ako muntik din ako maging bakla but lage ko sabi sa sarili ko nakakahiya maging bakla..ayaw ko kaya everything follows na babae na talaga gusto ko..and if itong mga baklang to pag na amnesia ito nakalimotan ang sarili sa tingin ba nila bakla parin ba sila? Possible na hindi na sila bakla 50/50 ang sagot jan..kasi yun ang nakasanayan nila na bakla sila mahirap sa kanila maging lalaki pero sabi nga nila umpisan mo sa sarili ang pag babago..now a days natatakot ako na darating yung panahon na kahit pag patay ay maging tama na kahit pag nanakaw ay maging tama na..dahil sa mga maling pag iisip..
............ sorry po opinion ko lang yan..

 

[jayendecastro]

So ano tingin mo ang alternative. Not falling between man or women does not disqualify them from being human at least diba. If ikaw si Gretchen what would you do?
How does that differ from telling an aeta, "no matter ano maabot mo, ano pinag-aralan mo dahil pinanganak kang aeta, dapat mamuhay kang aeta."

No one is denying their humanity.. i said this before walang kaso skin ang sexuality nila.. walang kaso sakin na they fight for equality.. but they are what they are.. either male or female… gay ka.. no problem ung a guy na bading… lesbian… sure.. ur still a girl na tibo…

That aeta comparison is absurd… thats about lineage and culture…success or failure hindi pa din mababago ung pagiging aeta nea… however he chose to live his life eh di mababago ung fact na aeta sya… kung ang ibig mong sabihin sa “mamuhay kang aeta” eh ung mamundok lang eh there is more to a person than his lineage…

Can an female aeta identify as white european guy?

Sorry dun sa gretchen bit.. di ako familiar sa issue na un…

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

now a days natatakot ako na darating yung panahon na kahit pag patay ay maging tama na kahit pag nanakaw ay maging tama na..dahil sa mga maling pag iisip..

Ito tlga sumasalamin sa takot ng mga anti-lgbt. Is this a really logically sound reasoning?

 

[-power_metal-]

Ito tlga sumasalamin sa takot ng mga anti-lgbt. Is this a really logically sound reasoning?

Oo anti ako but observation ko lang yan..and di siya valid. but kung iisipin mo maaring tama yan..

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

however he chose to live his life eh di mababago ung fact na aeta sya… kung ang ibig mong sabihin sa “mamuhay kang aeta” eh ung mamundok lang eh there is more to a person than his lineage…

So si educated aeta, allowed naman siyang mamuhay na katulad ng ibang educated non-aeta. At pinapatibay ito ng self improvement nya na education.

Pero si transwoman, hindi allowed mamuhay na katulad ng women. This is despite his effort to improve himself sa mas madaling tanggapin ng ibang tao na identity?

Nilalayo ko nga sa gender ang issue to expose our gender biases and as what it is - prejudice and bias. Natural kung isusubject padin natin yan sa existing gender prejudice na meron na tayo, you will come up with the same answer. But gender is only one aspect of identity like race and ethnicity. Does gender have to have a different treatment compares to other aspects?

At syempre sa sports, meron nmang compromise na pwede dyan to solve the unfairness. Transwomen who should allowed in women should only be those who were never exposed to hormones at the same level as men, that is one example.

 

[jayendecastro]

So ano tingin mo ang alternative. Not falling between man or women does not disqualify them from being human at least diba. If ikaw si Gretchen what would you do?
How does that differ from telling an aeta, "no matter ano maabot mo, ano pinag-aralan mo dahil pinanganak kang aeta, dapat mamuhay kang aeta."

Tapos sa US there was a time where black people are not allowed to use a CR for whites. The logic goes, dahil meron CR for people of color dapat doon lang sila. And this was justified by fears. They can cite examples of black people behaving like savages to justify the fear. This was a socially and traditionally accepted practice. Heck some people also use religious justifications because mormons had a belief that blackness is a divine punishment for sinners. How is this different from that?

Thats about racism and religious bigotry… and im not in favor of both… my point is not appealing to racism and religion, im appealing to what is a male and a female… not identity, not feelings… none of that..

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

Thats about racism and religious bigotry… and im not in favor of both… my point is not appealing to racism and religion, im appealing to what is a male and a female… not identity, not feelings… none of that..

Like I said, why does gender have to have a certain treatment which, if applied to other aspects of human identity like race, religion, ethnicity, color etc... it will be immoral. We can justify racism and bigotry with the argument of social convention diba? But it does not make it right..

 

[jayendecastro]

So si educated aeta, allowed naman siyang mamuhay na katulad ng ibang educated non-aeta. At pinapatibay ito ng self improvement nya na education.

Pero si transwoman, hindi allowed mamuhay na katulad ng women. This is despite his effort to improve himself sa mas madaling tanggapin ng ibang tao na identity?

Nilalayo ko nga sa gender ang issue to expose our gender biases and as what it is - prejudice and bias. Natural kung isusubject padin natin yan sa existing gender prejudice na meron na tayo, you will come up with the same answer. But gender is only one aspect of identity like race and ethnicity. Does gender have to have a different treatment compares to other aspects?

At syempre sa sports, meron nmang compromise na pwede dyan to solve the unfairness. Transwomen who should allowed in women should only be those who were never exposed to hormones at the same level as men, that is one example.

Can that aeta identify as a white french guy??

Allowed sila to live as a woman…allowed sila however they wanna change themselves… but they have to accept the fact there are just somethings that they cannot do…

Im 5’10.. no matter how i feel like im a 6’9 guy na may talent ni lebron i cannot dunk… baka sa try outs pa lang nga sa paliga di na ako matangap…kasi di ko kaya gawin yon…

Yes, i totally agree.. one aspect ang gender sa ating pagkatao.. lahat nman ng aspeto natin can either be beneficial or not sa atin…

Jan sa hormones im not sure if accurate ung info ko jan.. i think are argument jan is dapat hindi pa nagreach ng puberty bago nagtransition… minors yun.. thats what i know about it but im not sure if tama info ko about it..

Like I said, why does gender have to have a certain treatment which, if applied to other aspects of human identity like race, religion, ethnicity, color etc... it will be immoral. We can justify racism and bigotry with the argument of social convention diba? But it does not make it right..

Ung argument of social convention for racism and bigotry is misplaced…

Can un say the same for gender being based on biology misplaced as well??

A black man identifying as white does not make him white.
A male identfying as woman does not make him a woman.

Nothing is immoral to identify whatever u want… but its absurd na because one identifies as one thing eh all of a sudden ganon na nga sya..

Again its a part of who u are.. but its not who you are.

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

Im 5’10.. no matter how i feel like im a 6’9 guy na may talent ni lebron i cannot dunk… baka sa try outs pa lang nga sa paliga di na ako matangap…kasi di ko kaya gawin yon…

But still you can get in the tryouts kahit hindi ka 6'9". Kahit 5'10" ka lang there is no reason for others to think that you can't dunk, much less if you are a good player.

So in the end, yung belief mo na 6'9" ka does not even matter.

 

[Cee Jay]

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

A black man identifying as white does not make him white.
A male identfying as woman does not make him a woman.

Yes that is true. But it does not mean a black man deserves a different treatment from a white man. The same with the male and female. I don't think you are really concerned about the self-identification part. When we call our kids beautiful or handsome kahit panget sila, these are not statements of facts. And if anyone argues the factuality of that, that is just plainly being an a-hole.

And yeah, meron sleight-of-hand sa analogy ng height vs gender.
Yung sa gender, what we are talking about are things that they are "(not)/allowed" to do.
Pero ung sa height, it is an argument of what you are (in)/capable of doing.

These are not the same concepts.

Hindi naman issue na incapable ang transgender gumamit ng women's restroom. I don't know if you did this on purpose, but the word "can't" don't mean the same thing in;

-Short people can't dunk; And in
-Transwomen can't use the women restroom.

May scientific at measurable facts ang first statement when we ask why, pero sa second all we really have is convention.

 

[jayendecastro]

But still you can get in the tryouts kahit hindi ka 6'9". Kahit 5'10" ka lang there is no reason for others to think that you can't dunk, much less if you are a good player.

So in the end, yung belief mo na 6'9" ka does not even matter.

U missed the part ung sinabi ko na “i feel na i have the talent ni lebron”

Can i compete sa same level kay lebron just because i feel that way?? So do i need to be good player atleast to even have a chance??

Skills and talent will enable me to those things..not my feelings…

Yes that is true. But it does not mean a black man deserves a different treatment from a white man. The same with the male and female. I don't think you are really concerned about the self-identification part. When we call our kids beautiful or handsome kahit panget sila, these are not statements of facts. And if anyone argues the factuality of that, that is just plainly being an a-hole.

And yeah, meron sleight-of-hand sa analogy ng height vs gender.
Yung sa gender, what we are talking about are things that they are "(not)/allowed" to do.
Pero ung sa height, it is an argument of what you are (in)/capable of doing.

These are not the same concepts.

Hindi naman issue na incapable ang transgender gumamit ng women's restroom. I don't know if you did this on purpose, but the word "can't" don't mean the same thing in;

-Short people can't dunk; And in
-Transwomen can't use the women restroom.

May scientific at measurable facts ang first statement when we ask why, pero sa second all we really have is convention.

By cant im not referring to capability, thats whay namention ko ung there are things that we simply cannnot do…

Its not also an issue of treatment nman din… i have no problem treating them as gays, lesbians, trans and all that…but what they are demanding is to be treated as something they are not… they wanna be treated as a woman and be allowed into women’s spaces…

Why should it be about self-identity in the first place??

Beauty is subjective… one’s appearance just like gender is also just a part of one’s identity… im not gonna lie to my children and tell them they are good looking if they’re not… i will tell them to improve themselves, their personality, confidence…etc… i will not put them down but i will be honest with them…

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

U missed the part ung sinabi ko na “i feel na i have the talent ni lebron”

Can i compete sa same level kay lebron just because i feel that way?? So do i need to be good player atleast to even have a chance??

But they are not saying that they feel like they can perform like women.. its not about performance which i think is addressed already on the next point.

i have no problem treating them as gays, lesbians, trans and all that…but what they are demanding is to be treated as something they are not…

With this statement, makikita natin na there is somewhat an "expected treatment" that we can exclusively give to one gender or other. As if that is a fact. But is there?

Beauty is subjective… one’s appearance just like gender is also just a part of one’s identity… im not gonna lie to my children and tell them they are good looking if they’re not… i will tell them to improve themselves, their personality, confidence…etc… i will not put them down but i will be honest with them…

Which is a good point. When we tell a conventionally unattractive kid that they are beautiful we also explain to them that it is not literal. We often say, "you are beautiful in your own way".

And this is what we are doing with the lgbt. Especially the trans group. We affirm that they are also a woman/man "in their own way". We don't have to subject them to the old standards, which we really only think is right just because that is what we're used to. We allow them the liberties we took for granted by repressing ourself.

If we widen our perspective, ung usapan about sa trans na ito, this is the extreme end. If any changes will come out here, we can eliminate toxic masculinity too. And I am referring to the part where men can't express their feelings and similar standards. We eliminate the women ideologies that stopped them from even trying, like thinking that they can't compete with men.

 

[jayendecastro]

But they are not saying that they feel like they can perform like women.. its not about performance which i think is addressed already on the next point.

Sports is about performance.. its a competition about how one performs… and transwomen dont perform like women sa sports thats why they’re winning over biological women..

With this statement, makikita natin na there is somewhat an "expected treatment" that we can exclusively give to one gender or other. As if that is a fact. But is there?

Because there is…. Private spaces is one..medical procedures is another.. pronouns too…

If a transwoman comes to an ER and says na he is a having an abortion.. would u even consider that as a possibility?? Would u waste resources, manpower and time in treating him for miscarriage or would you check him for something else??

Should we allow boys to enroll sa mga all girls school??

Should transwomen wear tampons??

Can a transman get a vasectomy??

Which is a good point. When we tell a conventionally unattractive kid that they are beautiful we also explain to them that it is not literal. We often say, "you are beautiful in your own way".

And this is what we are doing with the lgbt. Especially the trans group. We affirm that they are also a woman/man "in their own way". We don't have to subject them to the old standards, which we really only think is right just because that is what we're used to. We allow them the liberties we took for granted by repressing ourself.

If we widen our perspective, ung usapan about sa trans na ito, this is the extreme end. If any changes will come out here, we can eliminate toxic masculinity too. And I am referring to the part where men can't express their feelings and similar standards. We eliminate the women ideologies that stopped them from even trying, like thinking that they can't compete with men.

We can affirm what they feel, what they wanna identify as.. i have no problem with that.. but only up to that.. affirming only their feelings and identity..pero u still have to be honest with them what they truly are. Its not about being traditional.. its about being real with them lang.

Toxicity can happen sa both genders… and the less of it we have the better… we can uplift each other naman.. a man who can express him feelings is still a man.. a woman who is strong and independent is still a woman… i accept LGBTQ for whatever they are.. why is that not enough??

 

[Kaplok Kaplok]

Sports is about performance.. its a competition about how one performs… and transwomen dont perform like women sa sports thats why they’re winning over biological women..

Sinabi ko na ibang issue ung sports sa CR issue e. Ung sports my scientific justification but not directly on gender, but on hormones, which could be dealt with science.
Ung CR issue ang lang ang concern ko dahil ang grounding natin dito ay merely culture. Kahit anong prove mo nag magkaiba ang women and transwomen, walang justification to jump to the conclusion na bawal sila doon. Yes, we call it now "safe space for women" but we can change to "safe space for feminine people", if you are that concerned with the technicality of the wording.

We can affirm what they feel, what they wanna identify as.. i have no problem with that.. but only up to that.. affirming only their feelings and identity..pero u still have to be honest with them what they truly are. Its not about being traditional.. its about being real with them lang.

Toxicity can happen sa both genders… and the less of it we have the better… we can uplift each other naman.. a man who can express him feelings is still a man.. a woman who is strong and independent is still a woman… i accept LGBTQ for whatever they are.. why is that not enough??

Eto ung wierd na part e. I say this myself.
"I'm okay with affirming the lgbt, as long as they don't make me play their game", where 'play their game' just describes some vague boundary we have, as if it is up to us to decide what they need vs what they want.

It reminds me of the judgement we also sometimes do to those who claim to be PWD with no visible markers of being disabled. In our mind "i don't think this person deserves a special treatment."

Why is that not enough? Because it is so vague, and it leaves a door open for "the right to homophobia and prejudice"

In reality, the only boundary we should be setting is when they physically or emotionally assault us, other than that they can do whatever they want, like what we do with any other people.